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GRISWOLD DNA PROJECT
From Coralee Griswold, genealogist for the Griswold Family
Association
We have had a great response to the call for participants
in the DNA study.
There is NO doubt now that Edward and Michael are related. In fact they
are so closely related that the clearest determination of a line split
seems to be in the "CDY b" marker and is as we would expect since Family
Tree DNA states that this is one of the markers that "show a faster
mutation rate then the average, and therefore these markers are very
helpful at splitting lineages into sub sets, or branches, within your
family tree."
Michael descendants - appear to carry a 36 or 37
Edward descendants - appear to carry a 38
This also underlies why we prefer the 37-marker test, since it is the
only test to carry out far enough to get this result. I would love to
see some Matthew participants. Some of the interested parties have said
they would like to participate but simply cannot justify the $150 for
the test at this time. A couple of the tests that have been done are in
fact due to the benevolence of a female who wanted to give substance to
her line.
From Sara's contact with Sonja (in England) we have one England
descendent who has agreed to participate, he just got the kit and it
will be a good six weeks from the time he returns the kit before we have
the results but I probably don't have to tell you how huge the
implications will be from that test in relating American GRISWOLD's to
English GRISWOLD's.
We had several individuals who sent tests in the first part of
December(2008, but it is too soon to have them back for evaluation, and
when they do come in, it takes me some time to study them and see how
they relate to the other results. I'm not even sure my hypothesis is
right (about where the mutation occurs) but I can say unequivocally,
Michael and Edward are related, which is something we couldn't say
before August, when we made the presentation to the membership.
Editor’s Note: If you have any interest in either
testing (if you are a male with the Griswold name) or in funding the
testing for someone in your family or another GFA member, please contact
Coralee Griswold at coraleeg@citlink.net. We have a rare opportunity to
test across the genetic lines before some family connections are lost.
What is achieved now will give direction to all our future research on
the Griswold Family in America.
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An interesting discussion thread regarding our DNA
project....this gives us some idea of the complexity of interpreting the
results and the importance of testing as many male Griswolds as possible
on both sides of the Atlantic.
Wally Grisold of Toronto, Canada writes:
This email is to inform you (although I am not a member of your Assoc.)
that my ancestors at one time carried the name Griswold. It was also
spelled Grizwould, Griswould, Grizwold and there is even a Grizzle
listed. The "W" in my line was apparently dropped in the 1700's. It
appears we started in the Banbury/Cropredy area of Oxfordshire. I have a
sixth cousin (Sonia Howson) her maiden name was Grisold. She lives in
Oxford England, we correspond regularly. I believe she is a member of
your group. I have just received my DNA results from Family Tree DNA.
You will find them listed in the Familytreedna. I have also submitted
them to www.Ysearch.org. I am sure that at one time or another there was
a connection...Unfortunately I started this family stuff after my
parents had passed on... My Great-grandfather Frederick John Grisold was
born in Banbury, Oxfordshire about 1852 and came to Canada in 1884, his
wife and children arrived a year later; he was a baker by trade. He died
in 1894. And I can't find where he was buried...
Coralee Griswold responds:
As I explained to Sonia we were following your results with high hopes
that it might bring us closer to the England-American connection.
Regretfully, you did not make a match to the GRISWOLD's who have tested
in America which was somewhat surprising and disappointing. All the
Griswold males without exception (at this time) have an exact match on
the first 12 markers those being: 13, 23, 14, 10, 11, 14, 12, 12, 12,
14, 13, 30. With 24 and 37 markers we start to see some deviations but
there is still a definite pattern...
In a nutshell, I guess what I'm saying is that we have no
match on GRISWOLD. I was going to recommend that you next log into your
account at Family Tree DNA and change your search from surname study to
complete database but I just checked it, and either you or someone else
has all ready done that. On that same page you will see "Y-DNA" results,
click on "matches" and you will see all the individuals that make at
least a partial match with your results. I see there are two individuals
(John Michael Baillie-Hamilton and Gregory Scott Malban) with a genetic
distance of two under the "25-marker" test. This means that there is a
54% chance you share the same ancestor within 12 generations and a 72%
chance you share the same ancestor within 16 generations. Neither of
them have their genealogy posted, so if I were you I would lay out my
line with as much as I knew then I would e-mail them (e-mail shown by
their name) and start working with these individuals to see if you could
narrow it down to what ancestor you might share.
I have not personally done much research on the Griswold's outside of
the U. S., but I know the French's did and their research as well as the
research of others who have worked in England was published in The
Greswold Family: 12 Generations in England. However, given the
unexpected results of your tests, I'm not sure how much you will want to
pursue that at this time.
I HAVE MY RESULTS, WHAT DOES IT MEAN?
If your first 12 markers show the following, then you can
be very, very sure that you descend from a GRISWOLD line.
393 390 19 391 385a 385b 426 388 439 389-1 392 389-2
13
23 14 10 11 14 12 12 12 14 13 30
While our sample is still relatively small (24 individuals) We now KNOW
that Michael and Edward were definitely related. However, there have
been some unexpected results with a couple individuals who were Griswold
on paper, but "not so" in DNA. As you might imagine this has caused some
consternation for those individuals. Therefore, I caution those who take
the test to be prepared that a small percentage do not test as expected.
We had one Griswold/Grisold test with close European
connections. I was very excited about getting this participant, but the
results were disappointing in that he did not match the rest of the
known Griswold pool. Before jumping to the conclusion that this
eliminates American families from ties to England families I would like
to see more participants from the English pool. When the first "Edward"
descendent tested, his test did not match any of the known participants,
which at that time were mostly Michael descendants. Initially we thought
that meant Edward and Michael were not related but now that we have more
data for comparison it is more likely that the first individual is not a
DNA Griswold. With more markers (25 and 37) we start to see some slight
variations but our pool is not large enough at this point to show a
definitive pattern that can segregate individuals within one line or the
other (Edward or Michael). If you want to understand your results log
into Error! Hyperlink reference not valid. with your kit number and
password. Go your home page and midway down the page under "Y-DNA
Results" click on <matches>. At the top of the next page you will see
all exact matches on a 12-marker test, and if you did a 25 or 37 marker
test, then as you scroll down the page you will see the same for those
markers. At the right of each name for which you "match" you will find
an icon that gives a calculation for the power and precision of
estimates of "Time to the Most Recent Common Ancestor." While it sounds
complicated, I guarantee that it is not and by simply being adventurous
you will start to gain some understanding of your results. It is a
simple concept in that the more markers you match on the more closely
related you are. It is however, in proportion to the numbers you had
tested. For instance a 33/37 match on a 37 marker test indicates you are
probably related vs. a 21/25 match where you are probably NOT related.
I will also make a plug here, if possible attach your ancestry chart to
your DNA so that those who cannot trace their ancestry might find
answers through yours. It is easy to upload your GEDCOM file and exclude
all living members. Here is where the GFA can help. If you don't know
how to do this, and assuming we have your ancestry, then please e-mail
me with permission to do this for you.
WHAT IF I DON'T MATCH?
Then again you need to log into your home page (as above)
and on the right hand side of the page click on <user preferences>.
Under "Please choose your preference for matching purposes" click on <I
want my matches to be set against the entire database>. You should also
upload your file to ysearch.org which is a free public service so that
people who have tested with different companies can compare their
results. Again, you will log into your home page, click on <matches> and
under "Additional possibilities for searching matches" click <click here
to upload to Ysearch.org >, from that point it will walk you through the
process but again this is where the GFA can help. If you feel
overwhelmed - e-mail me: coraleeg@citlink.net |
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